Balancing Business and Marriage as a Creative Entrepreneur with guest Matt Haberkamp

Episode Summary

We are passionate about our businesses! When we welcome a partner into our lives we learn how to balance devoting time to our business as well as meaningful and intentional time with the one we love. We get to bring them on board to support our dreams, passions and goals while also supporting their own. But how do we do that? In this episode we welcome Shaunae’s husband Matt to chat about how they began finding balance as a married couple while Shaunae continues to grow her photography business.

Episode Notes

Have you ever wondered what it’s like to actually be married to a creative business owner? Or maybe you are creative and you’re trying to explain to your spouse what you’re going through? In this episode, Shaunae’s husband, Matt, is here to share all about it. He is openly and honestly sharing what it is like being married to a creative entrepreneur and how they balance marriage and business.

Explaining Entrepreneurship to Your Partner

Whether you are in a relationship and beginning a small business or you are already a small business owner and looking to start a relationship, being open and honest about your job and your commitments is essential for getting everyone on the same page. For Shaunae as a wedding photographer in Seattle, her weekends were always booked with weddings and photo shoots. Being honest with Matt about her schedule allowed them to navigate other ways to see each other and build a relationship based on each other’s needs. They had to make the intentional choice to make time for each other and built their relationship on intentionality.

Finding Support in Entrepreneurship

Discussing business ideas and opportunities can sometimes be challenging when you have to check in with your partner. Maybe you are ready to take a new leap in your business but your partner isn’t a 100% behind you on that venture. Take time to talk about the pros and cons with business decisions. Be honest about why you are doing something and think about what you could bring in or give up by taking on something new. If your partner isn’t an entrepreneur, there will definitely be a transitional time of them learning more about what it’s like to own a business. Be patient and explain what it’s like for you. Together you will find a balance of how to support one another.

Setting Up Boundaries in Your Business

Setting up boundaries can take time and can change when your business or life changes. Choose days that are important to you and your partner that you will put work aside for. Birthdays, holidays, anniversaries – whatever is important to you, put business on the back burner for that day (if you can.) If you are working from home, let your partner know your “work hours” so they know just because you’re home, doesn’t mean you’re available. When you communicate your real boundaries to each other, you make it very clear what is okay and not okay.

About Matt’s Professional Career

Matt has been a creative his entire life. He grew up in Iowa and attended Iowa State University for Graphic Design. After graduation, he took an internship with the Green Bay Packers in 2015. Upon completing his internship, they offered him a position as Digital UX Coordinator. For five years, he held that position and worked for the digital team, helping build and advance projects. In March of 2020, he officially accepted a new position as Digital Platforms Manager with the Seattle Seahawks.

Follow Matt Haberkamp and His Work on Social Media:

Follow the Creative Legacy Podcast on Social Media

Find Sarah Online

Find Shaunae Online:


Podcast Transcript:

Shaune Teske 0:00
I think with anybody, your spouse should know you almost better than yourself and you should be living for that person. So when you’re struggling with something and you don’t voice it, you don’t talk about it. You know, you’re basically like holding down on your best friend.

You’re listening to The Creative Legacy Podcast, a podcast for creative entrepreneurs to build their business while living a life of intention, joy and adventure. I’m Shaune, a wedding photographer and educator that helps photographers, creatives and small business owners cultivate intentional lives and build their most abundant businesses. And I’m joined by my friend and co host, Sarah, a brand strategist and designer, helping entrepreneurs craft their brands to speak boldly and reach their ideal clients.

Sarah Schrader 0:52
Have you ever wondered what it’s like to actually be married to a creative business owner, or maybe you are creative and you’re trying to explain to your spouse, what you’re going through. Today’s guest is here to share all about it. Shaune’s husband, Matt is here and is openly and honestly sharing what is like being married to a creative entrepreneur. He dives into the triumphs and struggles that he’s had to navigate with Shaune, and how they built their marriage on intentionality, communication, trust and respect. Being a creative, too, he shares what it’s like to have two creatives balancing and bouncing their ideas off each other on a daily basis. He’s not holding anything back. So let’s get to it.

Shaune Teske 1:39
I think this has to be probably my favorite guest interview we’ve ever done. And it hasn’t even started yet.

Sarah Schrader 1:48
Definitely long overdue.

Shaune Teske 1:49
Yeah. Somebody that Sarah and I have talked about a while is having my husband come on and chat with us. And we are finally doing it today after a ton of persuading. And I feel like and asking him to join us. He has gladly agreed and it’s been a huge supporter of us. And so now he’s here and we’re going to talk to him all about what it’s like being married to a creative entrepreneur, and the triumphs we’ve experienced as a married couple, and also some of the struggles we’ve had to overcome. So I’m super excited. Listeners, this is my husband, Matt. Matt, say hello.

Matt Haberkamp 2:32

Shaune Teske 2:34
Well, thank you for coming, this is so fun!

Matt Haberkamp 2:37
Yeah, thanks for having me. This is it’s a new territory for me. I’m not regularly on a podcast like the two of you. So so this will be a good, hopefully a good time.

Sarah Schrader 2:48
I’ve heard you’ve had some experience, though.

Matt Haberkamp 2:50
I have been on one podcast, so I have very, very minimal experience.

Shaune Teske 2:56
You’ve now double that you’ve been on two.

Sarah Schrader 3:00
Cool. I’m excited to get to talk to you a little bit. I mean, I’m not married. I don’t have this experience. But I know many of our listeners definitely do. So let’s just jump in. Well, actually, you know what, I think we need to talk about this 17 minutes of getting started before this episode. I think this needs to happen.

Shaune Teske 3:20
Yeah, so we are obviously we are married and we live together. So we’re together. And we were trying to make this recording happen while we can see each other but then we were getting like feedback in our mics and our ears and all those sorts of things. So we were trying to do all these different things. So we’re actually still together, but we are recording in separate rooms with the door closed so that our mics aren’t picking up each other’s voices. But Matt is very much a tech person. So he’s trying to make it work with us being able to be in the same room. And it was just a lot of back and forth of like, Oh, wait, let me try this. And let me try that. And poor Sarah was just listening, like, what’s happening over there?

Matt Haberkamp 4:06
Basically, everything that was happening before recording the podcast is a synopsis of what it’s like to be married to a creative. Just keep working on it.

Shaune Teske 4:17
Lots of brainstorming. Yeah.

Sarah Schrader 4:20
And it all just comes together in the end. Cool. Well, why don’t you get started telling us about your story?

Shaune Teske 4:29
Yeah, so I want to talk a little bit first if I can about Matt, and then I would love for him to tell us all in his own words.

Sarah Schrader 4:37

Shaune Teske 4:38
Where he’s from all his, what his background is, and you guys can get to know him a little bit better. But I met Matt in 2017. And we started dating during kind of my busy season. So I think it’s a really interesting point that we’ll get into in this episode about what it was like when we didn’t really get to see each other as often as we would like, because my work schedule was the weekends. But so we started dating and very soon into dating, I realized he was the one for me. And we got engaged the next year. And then we got married in 2019. So it’s been a really fun experience. I think one of the reasons that we work so well together is because Matt is also a creative, he went to school for graphic design, and has been in the design creative world for a while now. So he might not own his own business, but he is very creative and very, you know, into problem solving and different technical things. So it’s not super hard for us to then talk about what it’s like to be creative together. But it is different when you are married someone that owns their own business and having to navigate those waters. But that’s sounds pretty good. Matt, like, is that a good like?

Matt Haberkamp 5:59
Yeah, I think I just need you to intro me anytime I’m gonna speak, I’ll just bring along a recording of my wife so she can give me the intro.

Sarah Schrader 6:10
I’ve actually seen that done.

Matt Haberkamp 6:14
I think it’s one of those things where the person that knows you best is probably always better speaking about you than you are. So I might have to try that out.

Shaune Teske 6:23
And then in your own words, Matt, tell us a little bit about maybe your background, your story and how you got to be here.

Matt Haberkamp 6:30
Yes, I grew up. I was born and raised in Iowa and North Central Iowa and decided to go to Iowa State after a couple years at community college where I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do. I always knew that I really liked art and design. But I didn’t really know what, what career I wanted to do, you know, every day. And so finally settle in Iowa State doing the graphic design program there spent four years there, really great school, was really big into the Greek community. And I always stayed athletics. And obviously, just being a design student, that took a ton of time. While I was there, I got to spend four months studying abroad in Rome. So that was a great, you know, cultural experience a great creative experience. And then after graduating in May, I spent a few summer months trying to find the job finally landed on a one year internship here in Green Bay. And then after the one year was over, I was hired full time, still doing the same role as a Digital User Experience Coordinator. And I think what I’m currently doing now have the mix of creative and technology and professional sports is like that’s me in a nutshell. So it’s kind of crazy that I get to do this every day. And I never thought that that was an opportunity, you know, growing up that I would be working on websites and mobile apps for professional sports team. So it’s kind of my growing up life and school background. And then of course, Shaune mentioned we met each other during her busy season. And I thought there’s no way that she’s going to want to keep seeing me because she just has to work all the time. And I didn’t quite understand it all. So I’m very glad that worked out and that I get to call her my best friend every day.

Sarah Schrader 8:24
You guys are so sweet. You mentioned like the busy season. Let’s talk about that a little bit more and what that was like and how you overcame that.

Shaune Teske 8:37
Yeah, so I can kind of talk a little bit about what we mean by busy season. So and then maybe Matt can share about, you know, his experience with that. And you know, coming into this situation not knowing but for me as a wedding photographer, I have seasons of work. So my May through October is really really busy. Every single weekend. I have a wedding or photoshoot or I’m traveling, and then it kind of slows down and I have some shoots or some weddings on some weekends and those offseason months, but my main shooting every single weekend, big time projects are always in the summer. So we started dating in the summer, and we would try to have dates on like Tuesday nights. Or, hey, I have laundry to do do you want to come over and watch a movie while I work on this thing or I have to work on this do you want to come over and do this. And it wasn’t the traditional okay, Friday night or Saturday night let’s go get drinks or dinner it had a we really had to work around dating on weekdays and making the time during that time.

Matt Haberkamp 9:52
And I think for me, it was like this is my second summer, you know in Green Bay. So I still was trying to learn more things we’re and, and trying to develop those close relationships and you know, obviously is trying to date and so it was a mix of everything is new and me not understanding anything about the wedding industry other than you know a few friends get married, but you don’t understand the industry itself. And so I just was like a complete eye opener. And like Shaune said, having to make the time, even when you do have to do on or something.

Sarah Schrader 10:26
I love the creativity and allow and just like, let’s have a date while I’m doing laundry.

Shaune Teske 10:32
We we had to be very creative. And I think there was at the beginning to that, are we going to continue this because both of us were so busy. And I didn’t understand he could just take weekends off and go on trips, or go see his friends. And I was getting kind of I remember very distinctly having a conversation and we went out again, because we’re busy. So we like met each other for lunch. At one of the delis in De Pere, Wisconsin, I don’t think is no longer there. And I remember getting mad about you’re leaving again this weekend. Do you not understand that I can’t do that, you know, and it was this weird, like, you know, you have free weekends, and I don’t and I don’t get I don’t get the luxury of just going off and doing things. These weekends have been planned a year in advance, I can’t just leave, and I think his thing to me and Matt you can kind of talk about it is that he’s like, well, I do get these weekends free. I can’t just sit around and wait for these things to happen.

Matt Haberkamp 11:39
Yeah, I think, you know, just in the same sense that there’s a, you know, for her as being a wedding busy season. I mean, my season runs half the year too. So when I finally do get those full weekends or or, you know, just the time where it’s not working until seven o’clock every night, it is nice to be able to do those things. But I think like early on, we both were so into our lives, or whether it was a career or I was traveling for you know, for a couple of weddings or personal weddings or going to meet some friends that already had planned trips, it was a win, I have the match these two together already. And now we’re matching these two ideas of what a busy season and an offseason look like. And it was just this like kind of like chaotic thing that none of us a month ago or two months ago, or whatever it was we’re planning on. And now here we are trying to kind of figure out how it works. But I mean, I think we’re very much used to it now. And I was very wanting to make sure that I was finding someone who understood what it was like to have a season because it’s very important to me of understanding that it’s not, you know, I don’t work a nine to five, and I do have to work holidays and weekends. And you know, sometimes something comes up on a Sunday, when you’re getting ready to go to church and breakfast. And now all of a sudden, you just have to work for four hours that you weren’t planning on. So I think it’s very nice to both have that it’s obviously very, very hard to plan and to do it all, you know, week by week or, or year by year when we have to go that far. But it’s very nice to have each other that understands that concept, I guess.

Sarah Schrader 13:23
Yeah, for sure. I want to lean into, like that understanding of each other, and I know Shaune when you are first starting dating. How did you explain to Matt, the whole entrepreneurship side and what you were doing there to get him on board with that? And then I format maybe like with you and respond with what it was that maybe like helped you to make that like acknowledgement and make it a little easier. So you had that common knowledge and understanding of each other? And then maybe if you have some advice for others, too, that might be experiencing that.

Shaune Teske 13:58
Yeah, I think for me, it was very clear when I was trying to date and meeting people that was like, first date material stuff was Hey, just so you know, this is my job. I’ve had this career now for oh my goodness, a few years. And I’ve been doing this full time for a few years. And this is gonna continue and and just you know, these are the dates I’m available. And this takes up a lot of my time. But it was very clear I think and open from the beginning that I when I want to bring someone into my life, whether it’s friendship or relationship that I will make the time for you. It’s just not going to be in the traditional sense of weekdays we work and weekends we have fun. It’s kind of reverse for us. And if you still have to work a normal job Monday through Friday, when are we going to make that time and it was kind of very easy then for me when I was dating other people to before Matt to find like okay, if you can’t roll that this isn’t gonna work. And if you can, how are we gonna make it work and get into our conversation. So I think that was the, I was very clear and upfront about this is my life. And I had a lot of people. A lot of guys say it was very intimidating and it was very difficult to then just make plans to get together when it wasn’t as easy as, oh, I can just meet you for happy hour, on a Friday when I’m prepping for shoot the next day. And I think I was very clear with Matt, and he got it and I think what was really helpful because he does have a season with football as he has every Sunday that he, or whatever, you know, whatever the season holds, the mostly it’s Sundays have, he is busy during that time, too. So I think that was really helpful.

Matt Haberkamp 15:51
I think for me, it was just the understanding that it was important and that it’s not a choice, it’s not a it’s not a choice to, you know, not go to happy hour or to not be home on Saturdays or to you know, have to go two or three weeks without it, you know, being able to meet up when we were first starting to date. It wasn’t a she’s choosing to not, you know, be around me, I was choosing to chase her career and to make sure that these other families were getting the benefits of her work every time that she was gone. And I think something that we got through pretty easily right away was just like, just being very like bluntly honest about it’s not that I don’t want to see each other or to go to whatever the event is, it’s just like I can’t, but I can do it these times or, making the effort to stay up later to, you know, go do something we might not normally do during the week, I think it’s just continued to be that very, I don’t have the availability, you know, try to work on our schedules more often together. It’s just being really upfront and not trying to fake it when I think you’re trying to first date you’re trying to be your best self, and make sure you’re not messing up or saying the wrong things are making her laugh. And it’s just like, we just had to be very honest about the time that we had to spend with each other and how important our careers were. And I think once we kind of we both established that pretty quickly, it was very easy to understand didn’t make it you know, overly fun that we didn’t get to spend the time with each other. But at least we understood that it was for good reasoning.

Shaune Teske 17:27
And I think that would be our advice to anyone, either if you’re trying to start dating someone that owns a business, or if you are married to someone already, and they’re deciding now to start this business. And now there’s going to be this shift in scheduling, that it is always about being honest and open with your partner with your spouse. And knowing that your work your career is just as important as your relationship and now it’s not that your career is not more important, our relationship is more important. But when you’re first meeting someone that this career that you have, is very important. And the time has to be put there to do your job well and to be able to serve your clients. And, you know, Matt then gets to learn all about the clients that I have. And now they know him and all that stuff, too. So I think just at the beginning, whether you, you are now getting into relationship with someone that has their own business, or maybe they’ve been working this side, hustle, you’re already married, they’ve been working the side hustle, they’re ready to go full time. And they’re asking for support and your life is gonna change now. It has to be open, honest, and really laying it out there of what you need from each other and what your expectations are going to be.

Sarah Schrader 18:43
That’s beautifully worded like perfect on it. Like I with relationships, it’s so important to make sure that the person that is in your life is on board with what you’re doing. I’m curious then if there’s ever been a time where it’s been a little bit more of a struggle to get one or the other of you on board for something that you’ve done and like how you managed to work through that.

Shaune Teske 19:09
Yeah, I think anytime there’s a travel thing involved with a wedding or now I’m going to be away for a longer period of time we really have to look at, okay, does this make sense? Does this fit in with our schedule? I think for wedding wise for me as a wedding photographer because I don’t have, I can’t do it every week or every weekend. I don’t have that chance that when weddings do come up. It’s kind of I have to take this. Now there are dates are non negotiables for us, and since we did just get married, our anniversary will be one of those. I don’t know if it will always be but this year for sure. It’s our wedding date is on a Saturday is on a weekend and I had inquiries for that date and I put in my calendar nope, this is our wedding anniversary. We’re taking time to be with one another and celebrate our first year of marriage. When so there are dates like things there are like, no, we have to do this and we have for family things to we’ll do, we can’t for Christmas, we can’t go back and see Matt side of the family. Because with both of our schedules, we have to be here with there’s no Not a chance to go and take a long weekend when we both have to work on the weekends. So a lot of times we have to then, you know, carve out time in January or February to go see family. And that’s even if I don’t, if maybe I’m not feeling up to it, or whatever we like have to do that. Because we want to see family, that’s the only time we can go. So I think some of those things have been just really understanding like, are these like, things you have to do? Because you’re going to make money and it’s going to help provide and pour into our marriage financially and different things like that? Or is it just something you want to do? Sometimes will I have like conferences or workshops where, okay, I think if I was single, I would just go and now it’s, we want to talk about it, we want to decide if that’s really the best fit for us. And, again, being open and honest with each other, if that makes sense.

Sarah Schrader 21:14
Yes, 100% make sense. So you, you talk oh, sorry, go ahead.

Matt Haberkamp 21:20
No, I just was gonna say I think for me, it’s you know, it’s exactly like what this podcast is like, now that I’ve been aware of what it’s like to be a self self made, you know, self working entrepreneur, like Shaune is she’s gonna bring me into things. And now it’s like, I’m on my second podcast ever type of deal. So it’s a it’s just like kind of getting through those types of things. And this has been a really good you know, piece for both of us of being able to talk not only yeah, we can, we can record a podcast, we have the the tools or the abilities, but bringing it in and making it something that’s worth while and listening to and teaching or sharing our experiences. That’s what’s been now another challenge on top of it. So we’ve been able to work on the things whether it’s one of Shaune’s businesses, or, or us kind of trying to help another family member friend do creative things, but having our own avenue to share or to work on has now kind of created this extra fold. And, it’s been a challenge to kind of just talk through what we share the lessons that we’ve learned, because it wasn’t always like, we just read a book, and then we had all these solutions. A lot of them we, you know, came to just because we kept working at it.

Sarah Schrader 22:46
I think that’s super refreshing to hear. Like that it was something that you did have to struggle through and work through and together. Because I know like for anybody who follows Shaune on Instagram, they’re gonna see that you Matt are very, like supportive of her like doing Whole30. With her, you’re just jumped on board. And he even did a three year birthday, which I think is awesome. But like, so we see that side of it. And it seems like oh, it could be so easy. But there is work there is communication that has to happen.

Shaune Teske 23:26
Definitely in everything that I have asked him to be a part of, or he shows up in my Instagram feed all the time. I’m always calling him out for things he’s done and how awesome he is. And but everything is it is something we talk about. He’s shaking his head, you guys can’t say he’s, he hates the praise. He’s so humble. But it really is always a discussion before I posted before we do this thing of is this okay to do is it okay to bring you into this. Because my life is so I’ve opened myself up to my clients, and to other business owners that I help. I am an open book. And with that came our relationship too and now there’s lots of things I don’t share about our marriage and about a relationship. But I probably share more than some entrepreneurs do on their businesses about being married to Matt and about our journey and how he has been, you know, my support and has been a best friend to me in so many places and now in business too. So I think a lot of times people have a hard time just getting their partner to understand what they’re doing. And then the next step is getting them involved in what they’re doing. That doesn’t always happen. And I think if you can involve your partner in some aspect of it now it doesn’t have to be this. you’re interviewing them on your podcast, but on some level where they can see what your life is like. And you kind of are removing that veil of they just think you sit at a desk all day and what do you do, if you can start letting them in, it’s gonna be easier to explain what you’re doing, and you’re gonna be able to communicate better about it.

Sarah Schrader 25:12
You mentioned before, how you have some days, like your anniversary on the calendar that are blocked, you’ve communicated like this is a boundary for us, this is going to be a day that we’re together not working. How have you gone about setting up boundaries in your business and life to make sure that you’re respecting each other, and what you’re pursuing each individually.

Shaune Teske 25:37
So definitely, with the dates, we have certain dates that are important to us, our birthdays are very important to us. Doesn’t always happen if you know there’s a football game on my birthday, because my birthday is in November, and Matt’s birthday is in January. So there’s a playoff game, you know, we’re gonna have to work or whatever. That’s some of the things like the half twos, like, we don’t get a choice. Sure. But I’m going to try not to book things on those dates and our anniversary is one of them. And then for us, another date is Sunday’s. Sundays are when it’s the offseason for Matt, that is our day to go and go to church go to breakfast, and then just like really be with each other, whether we’re working on a project or just relaxing, that’s kind of our time. But then we have boundaries, not just with dates, but then also with working and where we bring work because I work from home, my studio, home studio, everything that’s all at my home, I don’t go somewhere to go work in an office and then do things like that. I’m only leaving the house to go shoot or photograph weddings, my meetings are all at home. My office is at home. So we’ve had to talk about okay, when do you turn off work because you can work forever, you know, especially when it’s at home. So we have certain times of we’re at the dinner table or we’re cooking dinner like, no work and not even any phones like doesn’t mean we can’t talk about certain things if there’s something we’re trying to work through. But we’re not going to have our phone out, we’re not going to be scrolling and looking at things, it’s going to be our time I think dinnertime has been a big one for that. But then also like having tried to have times for the day of we are done working now or we’re done working at this time and now it’s our time doesn’t always happen because there are later hours. But we try our best with that and we try to set up you know, these days of the week or this day we’re going to try to do this.

Matt Haberkamp 27:37
I think just from a you know setting a boundary standpoint, it probably took us the better part of a good year to feel like we we had some of those more like physical boundaries of like what Shaune was saying with with having an office and be able to close the door on that or, you know, when I’m coming home from work then she knows that she needs to start wrapping things up and then making it clear of it’s just gonna be late I’m really in a groove with this project or these unexpected things came up so now we have to do it and then it’s the trust that you have the other person to just say okay and be okay with that and doesn’t mean that you know we’re running off to avoid events or other responsibilities but I think we’re very both passionate about our careers and dedicated to being relied upon for those different things and then it’s not always you know, it’s not always as simple as the thing we can do it later because there’s going to be more to do later on so I think just stating that upfront when we do find it out at the last minute that no the other person will be will be okay with it.

Shaune Teske 28:49
And we’ve had to go through that didn’t just happen like Matt said there were times of I remember him getting upset with me at the dinner table because I my phone out or I you know can’t you just take a break and I’m still thinking about business I haven’t turned it off in my mind yet. Even though I’m physically there in my mind isn’t there looming your partner is going to pick up on that so we had a really like, okay, when we’re turning off work we really are or if you need to keep working that’s fine but you need to tell me that it’s not half in at work half in at home, you know, it has to be all in work and all in at home. So you’re giving your work the best that you can you’re giving your partner the best that you can and we try to do that with everything with friends with family, that we’re not just like, you know, a little bit in here but my mind somewhere else.

Sarah Schrader 29:39
How then I mean you talked about like, you Shaune like when Matt comes home, Shaune you’re wrapping things up. Is there anything else you’re doing to make time for each other and focus on that relationship as well?

Shaune Teske 29:52
Go ahead, honey.

Matt Haberkamp 29:57
I think it’s um you know, we’ve been in just a constant, you know, trying to figure it out, because neither of us, since we’ve been together has had, you know, this entire two year three year period of, we’re all in the same type of work. And we’re all, you know that the equal amount of busy. And so it’s always like this kind of just trying to adapt. I mean, I’ve been doing some more freelance work before a friend’s business. And so it’s making the time to go to a coffee shop to work on that, because I know that when Shaune is home, that’s work for her. But if we go to a coffee shop, then she might be able to work on something that’s not just editing photos, or responding to emails, things that are part of her everyday habit, it’s, you know, filling up a creative part somewhere else. And so being able to do those things, and I do think one of the things that we’ve just continued to work on is putting the computer away and putting the phone away in those times doesn’t mean that we’re not going to be checking Twitter and checking Instagram and replying to things in the moment, but making an effort to just be present. And I think, with how both of us are and the careers that we’ve chosen, we are, we’re a part of those platforms, we’re a part of making those platforms better, and sharing content. And it’s, I think, it’s almost like hypocritical to say, don’t do those things when we go to work every day, and don’t try to do those things. But it’s just a, it’s just an effort thing. And we’ve continued to go through different cycles in our in our time together that, you know, make things harder, or make things more apparent that we need to be better about that or, or what not. So I think it’s just been a, it’s never been easy. I’ll say that for sure. I mean, like I said, it would probably take about a year to feel where we got to an okay point of understanding each other’s needs from a work life balance.

Shaune Teske 32:00
And I think it’s more than just, oh, here, I’m gonna schedule you for Friday date night, that’s it. It’s a daily, like Matt was saying it’s a daily, making time for each other, or trying to do things for each other to lighten the load so that we can we do get to see each other, then we can relax. So if I’m home, because I’m home, I work from home, if Matt has, you know, packages being dropped off or something, I can be home and I can get that so or I can run an errand, because that’s easier for me to do during the day, then he has to work all day and can’t leave and then has to go do it after work. And then I don’t get to see him even more, you know, so it’s picking up kind of the slack for each other to where we can so that when we get a chance to have come together, then it all works and we can then fully be together. So it’s doing those little things every day to kind of make it easier for the other person and then ultimately be able to come together and spend that you know, quality time together. We don’t want to just spend all the time we want to spend the quality time together when we can and sometimes it is scheduling dates, or it is making the chances to say hey, I would like to do this. We haven’t done this in a while we haven’t gotten here we haven’t I feel like we haven’t talked about this thing in a while let’s really sit down and do this and just being very open to each other daily of making sure there is time or you know, for getting up in the morning that we try to get it we always try to get up together. Unless I’m going to Pure Barre really early or and then we always try to go to sleep at the same time too. So it’s like even if I could stay up or he could say up that we’re we’re trying to be on the same schedule when we can because so much of our life is out of our control with timing in our lives. We try to stay on the same path it just makes everything a little bit easier.

Sarah Schrader 33:53
I love that I love that you do that.

Shaune Teske 33:56
Cuz I just say reading sometimes.

Sarah Schrader 34:02
I think yeah, I mean just being able to create some semblance of even more connection like of having that same schedule like probably has more impact than you realize.

Shaune Teske 34:13
It really does. I think we just like if we can return we’re going to go do the same things then. It feels a little bit easier. We can kind of balance that but there are times where the now like when I’m into my wedding seasons you know his schedule is 100% open on a Saturday and I’m on my feet for 10 hours a day. And then I think just being very aware of that, that if I’m doing that I’m not going to want to come home and go out and whoop it up or whatever my feet are gonna hurt I’m gonna want to relax and be tired and sit so if he wants to go and have fun that he better not have that going on when I’m at home because I’m going to want to come home and sleep or rest or whatever. And same with him of new when he has to work these later football games, he’s coming home at two in the morning. And if I have an early day, the next day try not to wake him or trying to be very aware of that. And, yeah, I think it’s worked out as well as we can make it work with our different schedules. And then really appreciating, I think, when we do have lighter loads, or it’s more of, you know, easier eight to five type days is that we really take those moments that are appreciated, and go, Wow, I don’t, how are we doing this, like, I don’t know how we got so lucky to have this time together. And usually, then we kind of freak out. Because we think we have to be doing something, we forgot something that we’re not used to relaxing and having a time, but just being very thankful when we do get those moments of being together in a more normal schedule, that it is very helpful.

Sarah Schrader 35:51
I want to dive into this because Matt, you are also a creative minded individual working in the design field. So I’m going to give a shout out to that because I’m a designer as well. But being two creatives, then I’m wondering how you manage that, like there’s the whole entrepreneurship side of things, Shaune. But you have like you’ve done some freelance work, like, how, are you supporting the creative parts of each other?

Shaune Teske 36:20
I think it’s, um, it’s really interesting, because I think that we joke all the time of like, it just has to look good, it has to it has to feel right in the room, or, you know, like going to an organizing, you know, a closet or, we’re picking out, you know, a couch or something like, it all has to look good. And it’s not a, when you’re a creative, you can’t sometimes it’s not an explainable thing, it’s just a feeling, it’s inside of you, it’s the way that you look at things. And you know, it goes outside of out of our house, it’s into our own work. So it’s asking each other about, you know, can you just look at this thing, it’s, it doesn’t seem right to me, or, whatever, asking advice of each other. There’s plenty of great times of like having that benefit of bouncing ideas or things. And then there are the struggles of I shouldn’t say struggles, but the times we’re learning a lot about the other one of Shaune wants me to be more involved with the things. And I’m not the sharing person and not that I’m a private person. But that’s not my career isn’t to be sharing and making these memories for other people so that they can share them. So it’s kind of learning to go into each other’s worlds, within that creative space and pull each other, you know, along with it. So it’s doing things like a podcast, not only because you love your wife, but because I am a creative in tapping into that part of it. You know, I can sit home and watch football all day long, but I still want to be a creative person at the end of the day. So I think it’s, things like, you know, just, I want to say it’s like a continual conversation of how we would go to a restaurant like, wow, we just really like those light fixtures or something, we should have them in a basement. Like you’re always pulling just like these creative things in your mind that I don’t think a lot of people if you’re not a creative, you don’t you don’t see it that way. You don’t even have to think through that. I mean, being a creative thinker, you’re almost always, for me, I’m always I’m gonna say critiquing, because I think critiquing gets a bad a bad rap as a phrase. But you’re always kind of like examining or walking through all these steps. And so it’s just a continuous process being a creative, right? So you do that in your kind of everyday life. And I’m sure Shaune is just sick and tired of me, continuing to figure out how we can be better and more efficient, or how I can, you know, match well, with this sort of thing we have going on, or whatever it is. But I think because we’ve, you know, Shaune has been for a long time, but me now getting into a point of my career of feeling very in control over you know, the day to day things. It allows us to go out and find other creative outlets, whether it’s no bringing me in with things like this, or, you know, I really love refinishing furniture. I’ve been doing some more freelance work. So finding the creative outlet for things that aren’t our day to day thing. You know, I think Shaune is really great about not bringing her camera everywhere we go, because that feels like the work part of it doesn’t mean she’s not taking photos with her phone every single step of the way, which she is. But I think it’s just the like, no finding other ways to be creative that aren’t exactly what we do every single day. And I think that’s been a really big growth point for both of us recently is doing them individually, but now I’m doing them together, finding those other creative avenues.

I think we never stop. I think we’re always there is never like let’s just turn off our creative brains. We are always picking apart how things look how that logo is. And then I think, for Matt, his big thing with design is, it’s not about always how it looks, but how it functions. Now, you know, this thing can function so much better. And being a UX coordinator during the user experience. And, you know, Sarah, and I had an episode about client experience, we’re always thinking about the user, the client, how can this thing be better? How can this run smoother? It’s always brainstorming. It’s always, you know, for some people, this might be so awful. We’re always thinking about it. Well, and we, I think, maybe some people might be like, Well, why can’t you just let it be? And we’re, always like, well, we could be better, how could we make it better? And I think that’s how we look at everything. I think just a side note of a funny thing of being married to a creative and someone both of us are visually creative, we tend to dress very similarly. Color wise, and we’ll put on an outfit and we’ll look at that and go, Wow, we match. So guys are like this.

Sarah Schrader 41:12
Yeah, that’s a thing, like in Korea, like couples will actually go out wearing outfits that look alike by their couples.

Shaune Teske 41:21
Yeah. bringing that to America. So whoever wants to get on board, like we’re there.

Sarah Schrader 41:29
Awesome is there anything else that you think will be valuable for our listeners to hear in terms of being married to a creative entrepreneur?

Shaune Teske 41:38
I think for me, when I was looking for a partner, and what blew me away, and it made it very clear, very early on that Matt was the one for me was that you have to be open, you have to be honest, you have to keep those lines of communication going. Because as soon as it stops, you know, it all stops. So I think in any relationship, the communication is the biggest part. And we can tell when the other person isn’t feeling, you know, up to it, or isn’t feeling a certain way, and we need to talk about it, we, I think with anybody, you, your spouse should know you, almost better than yourself, and you should be living for that person. So when you’re struggling with something and you don’t voice it, you don’t talk about it, you know, you’re basically like holding out on your best friend. So you need to be able to communicate, even if that is I can’t communicate with you right now I need to go deal with these feelings and have alone time and have this break. That’s fine. But it has to be dealt with, you can’t just like leave things behind, especially with, you know, bringing things into business, you need to talk about it. It doesn’t mean your spouse doesn’t have to understand 100% of your business, but you need to be be open and honest with what’s going on. And too if you want to have your spouse become a part of your business, even if you’re not working with each other on the daily but even just sharing something on social media, voicing that with them, again, being very open about why you’re putting it on there, why you’re sharing it. And I think just a funny part too, is then they’ll get noticed and recognized for being your spouse and being okay with that. I think Matt had to learn pretty early on when I was starting to share about him and share about our relationship. And now I share about our marriage, that people will stop him in public and say, oh, I saw this post your wife did. And he, you know, that’s up to him if he wants that or not. And he’s been very open with me about about what we want to share what we don’t want to share. So it’s just again, keeping that communication going and doing things for the right reasons. And sharing them instead of just doing it and asking for forgiveness is very important.

Matt Haberkamp 43:46
I think my big piece of advice probably is like being okay with being a part of, you know, of someone else’s of your significant others business and that person also being okay with not being a part of it. And I think that’s something that we’re always kind of trying to balance out is making sure that we’re stating, this is for a business reason, you know, we’re doing this because it’s work or we’re doing it because we want you to be a part of it and, and knowing that there are boundaries of but I don’t I don’t want to do that, you know, I’ll go to an event with Shaune and carry all of her gear. But that doesn’t mean that I’m experiencing the event as a participant, I’m still viewing it then as a worker, even if I’m not the one doing the work that she is so finding those, you know, those areas to make sure that we’re both on the same page and both being open to saying I don’t want to be a part of this or I don’t want to be a part of that. And I think that because you’re self employed or you’re a self starter any of those things. You have to have the support of your family or your friends and especially your significant other because whether it’s just simple things or running errands or, you know, lifting things when you need to, or if it is now, being more involved with the creating of the product or the service, anything like that, I think you always need that help, because we cannot do it alone. But I think that between the two of us, we’ve done a really good job of making sure that we both understand what we want each other to be a part of, you know why that’s important to us. And the things that we might not be comfortable with right now. But it doesn’t mean that it can’t ever happened in the future. I just think that you don’t marry a creative person and entrepreneur and feel like you’re going to be totally out of, you know, out of that space. And if it’s not you, then no, I think it’s just something that, you know, the couple has to work through of no. I think that Shaune would love for me to be a part of more things. And I think for me, it’s just a growing experience to be more open to it.

Sarah Schrader 46:06
Alright, well, thank you so much for to both of you for taking the time to like open up and be so honest about the communication and the lessons you’ve learned in your relationship with us. I think it’s gonna be so valuable for our listeners. And yeah, I’m really excited to share that with them.

Matt Haberkamp 46:24
Thanks for having me on. I enjoyed it.

Sarah Schrader 46:28
Matt, before we wrap up this episode, I don’t know Shaune included you in but we’d like to ask a few rapid fire questions to I guests. Are you up for that?

Matt Haberkamp 46:38
Oh, I wasn’t keyed on this at all.

Sarah Schrader 46:44
It’s nothing crazy, I promise.

Matt Haberkamp 46:46
No, go for it.

Sarah Schrader 46:49
Awesome. Well, are you a morning person or a night owl? Or we were included by this with another guest, an afternoon pigeon?

Matt Haberkamp 47:00

Shaune Teske 47:00
Yeah, mid afternoon pigeon.

Matt Haberkamp 47:04
I would say I’m a morning person or an afternoon pigeon. I’m not I usually like by the end of the day, I’m kind of I’m a wind down let’s go to bed. Fall asleep during a movie at at 9:30. Or, or earlier. But uh, I think I’m much more of a morning person or an afternoon person.

Sarah Schrader 47:27
How do you take your coffee or your tea?

Matt Haberkamp 47:30
I take my coffee with whatever I can put in it to make it not taste like coffee.

Sarah Schrader 47:35
Gross. Now that might be a conversation. How does that work?

Shaune Teske 47:42
He gets all the cream, whatever and I never have to see it.

Matt Haberkamp 47:48
I love the smell of coffee more than I love the taste of coffee. So I can appreciate Shaune drinking it every day. And it makes the kitchen smell great. But I just prefer to put some cream in it to make it not taste so much like coffee.

Sarah Schrader 48:02
What is your favorite way to give yourself that extra self care?

Matt Haberkamp 48:07
I love a good massage. Whether it’s from Shaune you’re taking care of me because my shoulders hurt or whatever. But I just think a good massage is just like a good reminder. And I think especially being a male. It’s not always thought of doing some of those doing some of those things for self care. But I do love a good massage, loosen up my shoulders and my back. We need to go get one now that I brought it up.

Sarah Schrader 48:36
What is your go to book recommendation?

Matt Haberkamp 48:39
Oh, this might be a hard one. I’m not much of a reader.

Sarah Schrader 48:45
You can do a podcast or something else similar.

Matt Haberkamp 48:48
I’ll do that. I’ll do a podcast because I do listen to a number of designer technology podcast. I really like Reply All is an internet based podcast but it’s really storytelling and about things about the internet. And one that Shauune and I are both really into is Your Hustle. Talking about it’s a podcast based on guys are in prison in California and just telling their stories of what it’s like to be on the inside and telling what it’s like I think that’s really important to learn about into kind of experience I guess from their point of view.

Sarah Schrader 49:28
What is your favorite indulgent treat?

Matt Haberkamp 49:31
Man where does it start? Peanut butter and ice cream are like my two go to treats. When I studied abroad in Rome, they don’t really have peanut butter in Italy like they have a lot more other little chocolate things and whatever but like Nutella and whatever. But for me bringing peanut butter over there was so important that I brought my own jar of peanut butter and it is always crunchy and never creamy. And any sort of any sort of ice cream. I prefer something with vanilla ice cream is the base that I’ll mix whatever in but never, never mint ice cream.

Sarah Schrader 50:15
Yes, I love when I meet another person who does not like minutes. Sorry. I just got me excited.

Matt Haberkamp 50:20
I think that like mint ice cream and then like what type of peanut butter you like are like very polarizing things. It’s never like, I could go with both, but it’s fine. Definitely don’t like mint ice cream. Definitely always crunchy peanut butter.

Shaune Teske 50:34
What is so funny because I don’t like mint, any thing for desserts. But I am a creamy peanut butter person. So we have to get two kinds of peanut butter for the house because we’re just that way. The ways to make it work.


Sarah Schrader 50:51
What is one place you’d like to travel next?

Matt Haberkamp 50:55
Oh, goodness. I’ve never really been out to the east coast. I’ve been to New York. But I’ve never been to Boston, Philly. I mean, anywhere out east and west Shaune going to school out there. It was like, she kind of feels like she’s done it all or seen it. And so it’s kind of anything that we haven’t really gotten very far. On being when I was in Europe, I got to go to a lot of places, but there’s so much I would love to explore. And Australia is on our list. You know, there’s so many places that we would love to go. But I think you know something that’s big for me right now, I’d be somewhere on the east coast.

Sarah Schrader 51:34
The last rapid fire question is, what is your legacy?

Matt Haberkamp 51:40
Oh, gosh, this is a hard one. Can we pause it for a few minutes. And I’ll come back and have a really good detailed answer? I think my legacy and this is probably something I’ve thought more about from like a career standpoint, probably in the last couple years, especially with understanding what Shaune has built in you know, is going through trying to continue to build or start new things. I think for me, I’ve really started to go by this lesson of and trying to kind of alluded to it of design used to be just kind of, you know what it looks like and then it was, you know that it needed to perform a little bit better. But now it’s like, it’s how it affects us. And whether it’s how it visually affects us, or how its advertising affecting you or how it’s, you use a product or a service, you know, all these things are now designed. And I think that, for me my legacy, I want to be known for as a person that had an impact in that world. And so right now, it happens to be professional sports, content and marketing and doing things on digital platforms. And I don’t know exactly where the rest of my career will go. But I hope that I will have that impact of we’re doing things the right way in the best way for our users, for our fans, for our families that have to use these things and that I think that getting, you know, companies or creatives to understand that how things look is very important. But we’ve now been at this point of how they function and how they affect us every day because if something is slow, we’re gonna move past it, if it’s not eye catching, we’re gonna move past it and trying to get people to you know, engage with you just a little bit longer and not doing it in an overly gimmicky way doing in a meaningful way that that is powerful for both us as the team or company. And powerful for the user to feel a part of it. I hope that I can have a big enough impact in that world to leave some sort of legacy.

Sarah Schrader 53:58
Awesome. Well, of course people can find a little bit of you on Shaune’s social media, but people want to go to just find you and view what you’re creating where can they find you?

Matt Haberkamp 54:09
I’m on Instagram. Shaune is going to like not like that. I’m going to plug my personal Instagram, I think is @mdhaberkamp on Instagram and then I also am really into fun socks that I wear to work every day. So you can find my sock Instagram account see what I wear every day @thesearemysocks.jpg I would love more followers if you want to send me socks you can also do that and I will wear them.

Shaune Teske 54:39
Yeah his like bio is literally like, collaborations wanted or something like something really funny. So and yeah, he literally and I see him every day. He takes pictures of literally with the sock he’s wearing and post them and then he’ll go what should I call these and then I usually name them.

Sarah Schrader 55:01
Just another creative endeavor you’re collaborating.

Shaune Teske 55:07
Why not right?

Matt Haberkamp 55:08

Sarah Schrader 55:08
Well, thank you so much for joining us, Matt. It’s been a blast talking to you.

Matt Haberkamp 55:12
Thanks for having me. I enjoyed the time.

Shaune Teske 55:15
Yes, thank you. And I’ll see you every day all day. Like most of our guests are gonna say that so I will literally see you right after this is over.

Matt Haberkamp 55:26

Sarah Schrader 55:42
Thanks for listening to the show. As always, we really appreciate your thoughts and feedback. You can reach out to us on Instagram @thecreativelegacypodcast or leave a review on Apple podcasts and we might include yours in an upcoming episode. All the show notes and links to resources from this episode can be found at

Shaune Teske 56:04
This episode may be over but we want to keep the conversation going. Find us hanging out over on our Instagram account @thecreativelegacypodcast and interact with us there to let us know your perspective and questions on today’s topic.