Building a storybrand by Donald Miller – book club

In This Episode

We are giving an mini update on the podcast and diving in to the next book in our book club: Building a StoryBrand by Donald Miller. Miller does a fantastic job in explaining how creating a story for our customers that makes them the hero, not ourselves, is key in building a brand message that reaches your ideal client or customer.


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Podcast Transcription: 

Sarah Schrader 0:00
There’s a quote after that, shorly after this is the day we stopped losing sleep over the success of our business and start losing sleep over the success of our customers is the day that our business will start growing. And I thought that was very powerful to be in that mindset of always being there for your customer, being grateful for your customer that they are there and wanting to serve them and finding a way to just be there like you like the guide to solve a problem for them being the guide there. And that I mean, that’s really what this all is all about.

Shaune Teske 0:41
Welcome to the Creative Legacy Podcast, a podcast to help creative entrepreneurs build their business, while leading a life of intention, joy and adventure. I’m Shaune,

Sarah Schrader 0:51
and I’m Sarah. Hey, it’s been a little bit.

Shaune Teske 0:56
Yes, it’s been a minute.

Sarah Schrader 1:00
We have an episode on our book club, which was actually from May, but as you can see, we’ve been taking a little break. So before we jump into that, we’re gonna talk about that a little bit.

Shaune Teske 1:10
Yeah, so we’re really big advocates, like we’ve talked about a ton on a podcast for self care, and really listening to what your body’s doing, what your mind is doing. And this is like a crazy busy season for both of us. And we needed to kind of take a step back and work on some of our other aspects of our life. And not only just business but personal. So I don’t know if anyone saw but I got married over this last month in May. So that was part of the reason I took a break was we literally weren’t even here we are getting married. So yeah, it’s been a really fun adventure, it’s been a really nice little break. And we feel like, we need to continue that break a little bit longer, because we want to be able to give you the best content and really put our all into these episodes. And right now, it’s just not possible with our schedules. Sarah is literally all over the world. So we’re just going to take again, another little break. So we can be able to really regroup in a few months and give you the best content, we can possibly give you.

Sarah Schrader 2:21
Shaune, do you want to talk about some of the exciting things you’ve been up to as well.

Shaune Teske 2:24
Oh, yeah. So it’s just been a whirlwind. Got married. I also became a pure barre teacher and pure barre instructor, which has been months and months of crazy training and learning new things. I started well, I started a while ago, but I’ve been doing more of my coaching and consulting businesses for small business owners. And then I have a few things coming up this summer where I’m actually speaking at a few conferences. So it’ll be really, it’s been really fun so far, getting, like ready for everything. And then now this summer is going to be even more wild and crazy and fun.

Sarah Schrader 3:04
Yeah, that’s awesome. And I also like the break for me. Not intentional with it. But in this break, like I’ve been able to do a lot of reflection on my own. And I have some things that I’m working on, as well, in my own business, a little bit of realignment. So I’m excited to share that in the future. But I’m not quite ready to, to give all the details on that yet.

Shaune Teske 3:29
Right. And we can’t wait to see what you’re gonna do. And for our listeners, where are you right now?

Sarah Schrader 3:35
I am in my final day in Valencia. Wow. So yeah, it’s been amazing. This has been the city that I’ve wanted to well, not the city, but the country that I wanted to come to you for such a long time. And to be here has been amazing. And I’ve loved it so much like it’s been my favorite city so far. Awesome. Yeah. And tomorrow, we are jumping a completely different continent because I’ve been in Europe for three months, but we’re going to Africa, South Africa. So it’s going to be quite different. Yeah, very cool. Yeah. Awesome. Well, I am so excited to see all the things you’re doing and in this and yeah, I mean, we’re looking forward to when we can kind of reconnect with all this and what we get to put out but at the same time, I’m enjoying the season as well. And you’re doing.

Shaune Teske 4:28
Right. And it’s important that you know, again, like we said, we want to be able to put out really good content for everyone for our listeners. And if we rush through this and try to put something together while we are this busy, it just isn’t going to give you our best and we you we think that you deserve that.

Sarah Schrader 4:45
Most definitely. Alright, should we get talking about this book?

Shaune Teske 4:49
Yes. I love this book. I’m all about it.

Sarah Schrader 4:53
I have to say. So we’re talking about Building A Brand Story by Donald Miller and I put this post out on a Instagram saying I was reading it for this podcast. And I got so much response that like, that’s an amazing book, I love that book, or I need to read that, like, so much of that response. And I definitely 100% agree that it is very, a very good book to read. And like, every business person should read this.

Shaune Teske 5:18
Yeah, it’s, it’s so good. It was recommended to me by some lovely ladies in my mastermind. And I’m like, okay, so I ordered it, and then just kind of left it there. And, um, and then we chose the book for our book club. And I’m so glad we did, because I really wanted to dig into it and give it the time it deserved. And it’s so good. Like, I love everything Donald Miller is doing. And he has a whole, you know, company and everything devoted to story brand. And you can become like, a story bit story brand guide, like and teach this story brand method. I mean, he has live workshops, he has online workshop is awesome. And I would love to attend one day, if I could afford it. But it is just, it is really, really cool. And so if you can’t like attend the workshops, or purchase the online, one, the book is like a great place to start. There’s so much I mean, of his content that would be in his workshops is in the book. So you are in a really great place. So if if you’re unsure what of it what it’s about, he actually walks you through the story brand framework. And it’s kind of how you’re able to clarify your message for your customers, for your clients. So that they kind of know what you’re all about, know what you’re selling. And just, again, make the process really simple and clear. Because I think a lot of us are marketing, we don’t know where to start. We’re all over the place. We’re sharing all these things. And he really breaks it down into like this story of like, there’s the seven pieces that every story follows every marketing thing should follow. And it’s just really neat how he walks you through it.

Sarah Schrader 7:01
Yeah, and I love it like the first chapter, I read the first paragraph, and it said, the problem was simple graphic artists and designers, I was like, uh oh, what am I getting into? But I 100% agree. And he talks about this story and how the messaging is so important. And so like what he was saying with designers, he gets into it a little bit in the book with like website design, and just being really intentional about the messaging that you put there and building that story for your client. He really puts it into perspective of like a lot of people like even our websites, about pages are all about, about you, like you’ve talked about yourself and what you do and your credentials and all of that. But like your website, you really needs to focus on who you are reaching. And he calls it the hero. So like there’s, like I’ve heard of before of like the hero’s journey, and he kind of like follows that a little bit too in this. But yeah, making your, your client, your customer, the person you’re trying to reach the hero and the messaging you’re putting out because you’re trying to solve a problem for them.

Shaune Teske 8:14
Right, so he takes you through this whole process and talks about how you’re, we always think we’re the hero of our own brand of our own company, but really the client, the customer is the hero, and you’re the guide, you’re the person that’s gonna take them on this journey, you’re gonna recognize the problem they’re having, you’re gonna give them solutions, or you know, whether it’s with a service you have or products that you provide, it’s really cool how he breaks it down. And what’s really great about the book is that they also encourage you to go to while you’re reading. So you can create your own story brand for your business and like break it all down. So I actually did that, while I read it. And I’m like, Oh, this makes so much sense. So, you know, it really puts you in a mindset of okay, who, who’s the customer? Who’s the hero? What, what kind of problems do they have? How can I help them solve it? What kind of journey can I take them on? It’s really neat. So then makes it very clear what you’re what you’re sharing online, in your posts. If you need to tell someone what you’re all about really breaking it down to the simplest, most most clear, possible explanation. It’s really neat.

Sarah Schrader 9:23
Yeah. And he talks about the importance of the story and creating the story. And he says that there’s two mistakes that brands typically make when they’re talking about their products and services. And I’ll just quickly mention the first one and that’s that they fail to focus on the aspects of their offer that will help people survive and thrive. And then the second one is a brand’s often will they cause their customers to he says burn too many calories in an effort to understand their offer and put back in a story. It’s like a sense making device instead of a person have to really like thinking about what you offer, you’re telling them in a way that’s easy to understand and clear and simple to follow. And he talks about how we easily will just kind of follow the story and like a television or even like reading a book, like he does this whole book as a story, essentially. But just something that’s easier to follow. So you’re not making an effort for your client or customer, the person you’re trying to reach to understand what it is that you’re offering.

Shaune Teske 10:29
I love that he shares like a really simple piece of advice. So if you’re getting stuck on like what to say, they have a mantra at story brand that says if you confuse you’ll lose, so you really want to make sure you’re not putting too much clutter out there with your words or what you’re providing. It’s clear, it’s concise. And it’s to the point of what you’re doing. So I really love that, that’s like, maybe we get really caught up on I need to add all these different things, I need to make it look like I’m doing all these things, which is great. But if it’s not, if your brain has to work too hard, when you look at someone’s website, and you don’t exactly know what to do right off, like within 10 seconds, you’re going to lose them because it’s not very clear. So he talks about too, about how do you make your story clear, and the three crucial questions that you need to ask, what does the hero want? Who or what is opposing the hero, getting what she wants? What will the hero’s life look like when she does or does not get what what she wants? So it’s, it’s kind of like, like we said, you know, what, what are what are your customers want? What are they looking for? How is their life gonna be better if they work with you, or if they buy from you? And that’s what your marketing needs to be, it needs to answer those questions. What do you offer? How will make someone’s life better? And what do they need to do to buy it? Mm hmm. I think the best part of the book, I mean, this is kind of different from some of our other books, because really, this is like a walking through this process. So it’s kind of hard to like pull some quotes and some different things. But he talks about like, like we said, that your client, your customer is the hero is the hero of the story. And you’re the guide, and one of the biggest parts of the guide, and one of the biggest, you know, parts of having a business is remembering those stories and about us, it’s about us, helping people, we need our businesses to be about other people and helping them get to their end goal to get them to success and to thriving and whatever, whatever we want that to be. And what’s great about this book is he has lots of examples. I mean, big examples of like, you know, Steve Jobs and Apple, but then like, what if you’re just, you know, a rug salesman, and the end is you want them to have a beautiful rug for the home, like, that’s fine. Yeah, that’s still great, we still need to put our people first, make them the hero of the story and help them get to that place. So I think that’s really cool. He also talks about two characteristics that a guy needs to have. So what we need to have, as business owners, a brand must communicate themselves as being empathetic, and having authority. So you need to be able to understand the pain points that your clients going through, you need to be able to hear them and speak to them in that way in your marketing material, that you get their struggles, you get what they’re going through. But you also need to be able to promote what you’re doing with authority. I mean, he gives an example of like, if you go to a nutritionist, and you’re like, I need to lose 30 pounds, and the nutritionist is like Yeah, me too. Like, wait, what? So there’s like a difference between like connecting and empathizing, and still being the one with, you know, the authority and being able to show them the correct way to go.

Sarah Schrader 13:52
Mm hmm. Yeah, I think one point that is very, like it’s mentioned over and over again, in the book, and you brought it up too is making sure that the your client, your customer is the hero, never making yourself one. And one example I loved of that was when he talked about Jay Z. And he tried to launch a music streaming service at one point. But his goal in that was to make artists money not to serve the listeners. And there’s a quote after that show later, this is the day we stop losing sleep over the success of our business and start losing sleep over the success of our customers is the day that our business will start growing and I thought that was very powerful. To be in that mindset of always being there for your customer being grateful for your customer that they’re there and wanting to serve them and finding a way to just be there like you like the guide to solve a problem for them being the guide there and that, and that’s really what this all is all about.

Shaune Teske 15:00
Yeah, and such a great point that I love that that was the example. Because in their minds, they were like, okay, the music industry is so dominated by these other streaming services, we, you know, it was a great idea, like, let’s put the money back musicians are musicians, but musicians aren’t gonna, they don’t need to pay each other to hear their music. So they forgot about with the main person that was listening, and that’s why it didn’t work out. It you know. So that’s like, the main point of this is, and we need to be reminded of that, I think that’s hard, we get so caught up in, I’m my brand. And I’m, you know, it’s me, me, me. And that’s really what it’s all about who you’re serving. There’s another part in here about how to make a great first impression, whether it’s, you know, you or your website, or whatever, maybe however they come across you, there’s two great questions you can ask, looking at your site, you’re looking at someone else’s site, whatever, how can you make sure that you’re making a great impression? The questions are, can I trust this person? And can I respect this person, and if people can say yes, about your brand, to those two questions, then you’re in a good spot. But if you’re not giving them anything to trust you on or to respect you on then you know, it’s gonna be a little harder to kind of win them over.

Sarah Schrader 16:15
And like reading through this book, he gives a lot of examples of how to do certain things like that, like building trust, an example of getting testimonials. But there’s a lot in here that he really he tells you what to do, and then shows you how to do it,

Shaune Teske 16:29
Which is so nice. And so we don’t want to give that away. Because we really want you to go get the book. It’s amazing to like actually walk through it with the website, or you can print it off or whatever. But it’s so nice to like, take your message and take what you’re doing through the process as you’re reading. It’s, it’s fabulous.

Sarah Schrader 16:50
I think one other point that really stuck out to me, and I’ve heard it asked before too, how often should you be posting an offer? He talks about that in the book, too. Like even on your website, like how often does the call to action show up? Because people aren’t mind reader’s like, obviously, it seems obvious that you want them to buy into your product or service, but you need to guide them to that point. And you have to find a way that will like user story, find a way that’ll get them to want to click that button. And he talks a little bit of like dating versus marriage. And he says like, will you go on a date with me? And the client says yes. And then he says, like, you give them this thing. And then maybe like a PDF guide or something like some easy buy in. And then you say, will you marry me? And that’s like the buy the service or the product? And they say no, then it’s, well will you go on another date with me and you just continue giving them value until they’re like, Okay, you’ve given me enough value, I trust you. Yes, I’ll go all in. I’ll marry you, I’ll buy that service or product. I thought that was such a fun, just kind of way to look at it if I’m perspective.

Shaune Teske 18:09
Yeah, and I think the other part of that too, is you need to tell people to buy, you need to have a Buy Now button, you need to have a schedule an appointment button and you need to have a, if there’s no call to action, if you’re giving them all this great content, your website’s clear and whatever, but then there’s no next step, you’re not going to know what to do, you know, he makes it very clear, like you need to take your, your hero, your customer on a journey. And if they don’t know where to finish, if the end is, you know, now we work together, but they they’re not gonna know you need to literally and he has in here like, buy here, by now, order today, schedule your call, whatever it is, and like lays out. You need to be telling people to buy to purchase and have it on multiple piece like places on your website. So it’s not just this like Oh, hidden button, they need it to be like drawn out and called out to do. And I think that’s cool. I think we get nervous about doing that. Because we’re like, oh, I don’t wanna seem too pushy, or whatever. And he’s like, No, you need to feel confident in what you’re selling or what you’re offering. And by having the buy now or the schedule an hour, whatever that is letting people know that like, yes, let’s work together. It’s here. I’m confident in what I have and what I do. And I want you to be a part of this journey.

Sarah Schrader 19:32
Yeah. One other really great example he gave for that was he talked about, I forget exactly what but he was looking at a website and researching. And he found this website that looked amazing and had a great hero image. But he couldn’t find the information or a place to get the information except for a phone number that you could call. And so he went to another website. It really did not look all that great, but it gave him exactly what he needed. And so he ended up going with that company because they provided that the space to say, I’m going to give you what you need, I’m going to solve your problem.

Shaune Teske 20:11
Yeah, it was like he it was for a presentation that he was doing and he didn’t have time to, to create it. So yeah, one was beautiful and whatever, but there was no, there was no clear message, nothing really, really said, like we will give you like the presentation of your dreams or something like that is very clear. And then there was like a contact button. And then if you get a free PDF, just like boom, get me in with that. And then we’ll go to the next level. I, you know, you gain my trust. And that’s like the big thing too, with your, with your customers and your clients. It’s all about building that trust, being the authority in what you’re doing and be very proud and confident in it to be able to share and to sell. So yeah, it was that was a great, I just love it.

Sarah Schrader 20:55
Yeah, I’m gonna serve one quote, last quote from that section that I wrote down, and it says, it’s true, we don’t want to constantly beat our customers over the head with direct calls to action. Of 1000s of clients we’ve worked with, though we’ve yet to encounter anybody who oversells, whilst people think they’re overselling when in truth, their call to actions false softer than a whisper.

Shaune Teske 21:16
Yes, we need to be louder about what you do and selling it and actually like trying to get people to work with you. There’s another piece in here that was kind of like a reminder that we talked about, where you’d mentioned that quote, where if once we lose sleep over our customers journeys, you know, that’s when our business is going to start growing again. There’s also another point this is great brands obsess about the transformation of their customers. So it’s not just about like selling a product or selling a service, how is their life better? How, how is their life transformed now that you’re in it. And again, when you’re selling a product, you’re thinking, Okay, I just sell ice cream, whatever, it could be the best ice cream, or the best experience of their day or their week or whatever. And I think then it’s bigger for people who are doing service type things. You know, whether you’re a photographer, designer, or coach or anything like that, we can really go into someone’s life and like transform them in a in a really neat way. It’s so powerful. So I think that was just a good reminder for me that you need to be obsessed with what the transformation your clients are going through, and being able to pour into them to give them that that great transformation.

Sarah Schrader 22:31
Yeah. He talks a lot about like confidence and what you are offering too, like directly after the quote, the next like header is do you believe in your product? And he says, the reality is when you try to sell passively, we communicate a lack of belief in our product. So yeah, just, there’s another part too like talking about this similarly as well. And if we aren’t showing up in this way, like we aren’t giving confidence, we’re not giving that authority that we need those two things and authority and the trust.

Shaune Teske 23:08
Right, that’s awesome. The last part of the book, which is really cool. So you you walk through this framework, he tells you, like every step that you need to go through and like gives you examples. And you have literally provides you with the website then to create your own. And then at the end, it’s now how do you implement that in your, in your world in your business? And that’s what I think is so beneficial about this book, because not only does it give you the framework and what to do, but now it tells you how to use it, like How perfect is that. So it’s first is like your website, how to create a better website. And then it’s like into your email marketing and all that and how you need to be doing email marketing. No, that’s like no one wants to do it, I get it. But it’s so important to be list building and nurturing your clients with your content. And then he also talks about making sure if you have employees or if you’re a bigger brand, that your employees know what’s going on, like you can understand you could have gone through this transformation of going through story brand, but if your employees don’t know what’s going on, you know, it’s gonna be different, it’s gonna be a different experience. So you need to make sure that the message is very clear with everyone. And that whoever you talk to in the company that can can be able to share the mantra you guys have created and the story brand that you’ve created. He gives an example of a hotel and it got down to the point of like, they wanted it to be a very luxury based place where guests can relax and just unwind and so they like had all these different things going on their website and they had pictures of the rooms and they had pictures of whatever and he you know, they got really clear about their message and they want they want it to be a place to relax and and be a really nice, upscale place so they change all the images so pictures up getting massages and enjoying food and really putting the hero, the customer in that setting. And then again, taking it to the next step of making sure all your employees know that. So they said, like you can go around to this day and like still ask an employee, what’s the goal, and it’s for guests to relax. And for them to have a luxurious experience.

Sarah Schrader 25:22
I thought that was really interesting, he says, almost like creating a second brand story for your employees. So that they, they can really dive into this as well. And he talks about, he just gives a scenario of an employer working in a company, he does it both ways have one where the story is not really clear, he just kind of like there and hired another one where he, it’s really clear as what the story is, and what they’re trying to do. And they’re just two very different realities. But the reality of having the connection to the story, and having everybody on board with this ideal that this company is trying to put forward gives just so much more room for people wanting to work there and being excited about the work that they’re doing. And just growing with the company, instead of like having too much turnover, because people are leaving all the time because they’re not connected to it. And yeah, you mentioned like is you said like having your employees know it, because that’s such a great marketing tactic even to have the employees be able to say and be a reference. And one of the things in the example that I mentioned with the brand story was like, the person gets hired and sees this video and about this mission. And he’s like, Can I have that video, I want to go and share this with all my friends and show what a great place I’m working for. I just thought that was kind of funny. But I thought, one company that came to my mind as I was reading this, what was ConvertKit. I don’t know if you know, their motto, yeah. But they have the approach of their business is to help creators earn a living online. But they also have a motto that the whole team reflects on and that is to create every day, or, no there’s two. To create every day and then teach everything you know. Ah, so they’re all really behind that. And they’ve really like educate on their business or what they do. And that allows them to approach their own, like all them to really excite about approaching their own clients and these creators that are trying to help build their businesses online.

Shaune Teske 27:36
I love it, I you can see so many people that are doing this. And really embracing the story brand, the message and being really clear about it. He also talks about Dave Ramsey, and how they like went there. And I’m like, oh, man, I just wish I could be there when they heard Donald Miller and Dave Ramsey, were hanging out.

Sarah Schrader 27:58
Oh my gosh,

Shaune Teske 28:00
I just want to watch that. So cool. But anyway, I mean, just how didn’t even know they were kind of doing this already. They didn’t understand that they were already doing all those things and transforming people’s lives like that. So it was really cool to hear, or to read all these different examples and to learn about all these other companies that are already doing this. And companies, you can look up to it and pull from for inspiration.

Sarah Schrader 28:25
Do you have any other comments on this book Shaune?

Shaune Teske 28:28
No, I love it. I highly recommend it. I think definitely get it and go through it with your own business brand and he talks about you break it down. So if you offer two things, then do it for the two things you offer. Don’t smoosh it all into one like break it he even has like if you have multiple products if you have multiple services, different businesses, like do one for each thing to get really clear when you are marketing for that item or that service. So I did it. I loved it. It was like oh yeah, like do I have this makes me want to go through my website and make sure I have more call to actions. Definitely this book is definitely like a get your button to here and do some things. So I recommend getting it and then yes, following taking the time to do it. The book the read itself is like super fast and finishing in a day so and then like do it and then take the time to like do story brand with it. It’s so worth it. And you’ll be like a huge fan, like I am now, and just want to be in all of it all the time.

Sarah Schrader 29:32
I’m curious if you don’t mind sharing since you did this. He talks about just kind of like having that quick. A couple sentences to go to did you go through and say what that was for you?

Shaune Teske 29:45
Yes, a couple sentences for like what my business is? Yeah, so that’s the first part is like figuring out like, what’s your elevator pitch kind of thing. Like what’s the thing you do? So for my coaching business, I did it for my mentoring coaching business and so mine is helping entrepreneurs build abundant businesses so they can enjoy their lives. Hmm. Yeah. So it was very clear, very simple. Yeah. And just, that’s what I’m going to do. So I took through, like, it has to go through like, what? So it’s like you have a character that’s your customer, they have a problem, what’s the problem, they need a guide, that’s you. And then it just the whole thing takes you your whole thing. It’s like, I really appreciate that. It’s really nice looking, too. It’s not like, ugly, like just a notebook or something. It’s like these cute little boxes, and then like takes you on this little journey. I really like that. It’s just very clear. And if you’re having questions, there’s a little tutorials too. But yeah, and then it’s all it’s saved for you. You can print it, you can share it, whatever. It’s really nice. You can make as many as you want. So if you want to make like I said, make different ones for different businesses, you can. It’s lovely.

Sarah Schrader 30:57
Yeah, I agree. He makes it super simple. If you follow it with a book, there’s a portion and a reminder at the end of each chapter. So he makes it super simple.

Shaune Teske 31:04
Yes. So everyone should do that. And then tell us what they do with it. Because I think

Sarah Schrader 31:11
I want to make up the prompts in our Facebook group for this episode.

Shaune Teske 31:16
It’s so good. You’ll be so thankful you took the time to do it.

Sarah Schrader 31:20
Cool. Well, thanks for jumping on this call. I know you’ve been super busy to do this episode.

Shaune Teske 31:29
Yeah, I’m glad we could talk about this, I always talk about anything by Donald Miller. Because I am a story brand geek. I love this. I want it because it’s so true. I mean, every story, every movie, everything goes through this. So it’s just it’s lovely. And I think everyone needs to do it in their business, get really, really clear about who you are and what your message is and you’re gonna be surprised how people start booking with you more and more.

Sarah Schrader 32:00
Awesome. Well, while they are taking this break, there are still ways to stay connected. Obviously, you can follow us on social media at The Creative Legacy Podcast and in our group. Please use that as a space to continue conversation. I’ll be sure to pop in when I can. And maybe Shaune, if you will, too. But yeah, let’s like that is definitely a space we can continue these conversations and all the topics we have talked about, as well as things that maybe in the future that we can touch on as well.

Shaune Teske 32:28
And all our old episodes are still live and you can still listen to them and get all their goodness we have so much great content already out for you. So take a listen and we hope you have a great summer and really enjoy your time as well.