Faith Not Fear with Myles berrio
Building a new business can be scary. Starting a new journey in your life can seem overwhelming. But when you choose to live by faith and not fear, the world opens up to you. Of course, there will still be challenges and obstacles to overcome but you will be better equipped to handle it. In today’s episode, we are joined by Myles Berrio – a wedding and commercial photographer, serial entrepreneur, and author. Without a traditional business background, Myles showed up every day and put in the work to create and run multiple businesses. He credits choosing faith over fear to his success in business and in life.
About Myles Berrio
Myles is a 26-year-old wedding and commercial photographer living in Atlanta, GA. His life entails traveling all over the US and the world capturing the love stories of all types of couples while also being blessed to work with some of the largest, most well known companies such as Target, Netflix, Uber Eats, WeWork, and Revolve. As much as he would like to be called a photographer, at heart he really is an entrepreneur. Aside from photography he also enjoys his other businesses in consulting, e-commerce, and the food industry. He is a published author working on his second book. To sum it all up, most people will say he’s usually the happiest guy in the room.
To Build Your Business and Your Life in Faith and Not Fear
You end up creating what it is that you’re afraid of when you live your life through fear. Opportunities and doors start opening when you live your life by faith. When you live through faith, it doesn’t mean it will always be easy but it will always work out for you. When you go into business, your business might fail for a certain amount of time but that doesn’t always mean it will fail forever. If you are willing to trust, learn what you don’t know, and put in the work, you can make any business successful.
Practical Tips to Live in Faith Over Fear
Start with what you have and where you are. You can begin by building a habit of taking opportunities and strengthening your faith. Commit to saying “yes” to new things that you really want to do. It’s important to not let your excuses rule your life. Recognize when excuses pop up and figure out your best way to overcome them. Know who you are and determine what motivates you the most, that will push you towards your destiny. If there are beliefs you have today that are impairing your ability to move in the direction of where you want to go in life, then you can let go of those beliefs and accept new beliefs.
How to Say “No” to Fear When It Creeps Back In
Fear will never leave you completely. Even the most successful people in business still deal with fear and imposter syndrome. When the fear creeps back in, it’s important to remember what keeps you going. Your why in business. Remember why you wanted to start this business in the first place. You need to choose a why that’s bigger than yourself that will challenge you even when fear comes back. Fear will have no power over you.
Find Myles’ Book, The Captioned Mindset, Online
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Myles Berrio 0:00
I mean, it can be anything that will drive you that’s bigger than yourself to stop looking at your problems as some large elephant or some huge staircase that you can’t get up. And it’ll start to challenge you. Even when fear comes back up when you’re going through something, and you’re starting to be successful, but that fear comes back, you’ll kick that fear run off the door, you go woah woah woah, like, Hey, let’s go back to why I’m doing this in the first place.
Shaune Teske 0:28
Welcome to the Creative Legacy Podcast, a podcast to help creative entrepreneurs build their business, while leading a life of intention, joy and adventure. I’m Shaune.
Sarah Schrader 0:38
And I’m Sarah. We are excited to have Myles Berrio with us today. He is a wedding and commercial photographer living in Atlanta. And his life entails traveling all over the US and the world capturing love stories of all types of couples. And he’s also been blessed to work with some of the largest, most well known companies like Target and Netflix, Uber Eats. So some awesome names in there. And although as much as he would like to be called a wedding photographer at heart, he’s really just an entrepreneur, and he’s enjoying his other business as well, and consulting ecommerce. He has a really exciting food thing going on, which I’m sure we’ll hear from him about. And he’s also a published author. So lots of things going on. And we’re really excited to have him here with us today. So thank you for being here, Myles.
Myles Berrio 1:28
Yeah, no, of course, thank you guys for having me.
Shaune Teske 1:32
I first heard of Myles through Rising Tide Society. And I obviously had to take those next steps that we all take and friend him on Facebook and follow him on Instagram and just be an internet stalker really was motivated, inspired by all his posts that he shares. He’s great. He’s great with words. And he’s a great speaker. And when we were looking for different people that we wanted to have on the podcast, we got your name from Natalie Frank, about having him on about I don’t know what he would talk about. But he’s just such a great speaker. And that was I remember, I remember knowing that and like, thinking that about you. So that really clicked like, yes, we have to have him on. So we kind of now have met online, but we’re super excited that you’re here, like Sarah said, and you’re going to be sharing some really awesome things with us today. And I can’t wait for our listeners to hear that.
Yeah, no, seriously. Yeah, I mean, take it away, I am open to share whatever you guys want to know. And, yeah.
Sarah kind of shared a little bit about yourself a little bio, but we would love to hear in your own words, a little bit about who you are, what you do, and kind of what got you on that journey?
Myles Berrio 2:54
Yeah, for sure. I mean, I first want to acknowledge, thank you for just sharing such amazing words about who I am, and whatnot. But I guess to really preface this, before we get into any conversation, if anyone’s listening to this, you know, it can, it can very easily just seem like a person becomes so distant because of really all the accolades or all the titles or all the things that they’re doing. But I mean, I’m actually really not doing a lot of things, I think, I guess what I’ve decided to do in my life, because there’s really a lot of things that people can do. I mean, there’s so much out here in the world. But there’s a few things that we really, really love and really care about. But for whatever reason, we’re held back from doing those things. And it’s typically probably more than just one thing. Even someone like Tiger Woods, who’s like a, an amazing professional golfer actually does really well in tennis and does really well and other things. And, you know, so I just want to just really put that out there, thank you for sharing all those things. But, man, hopefully this can really just encourage someone that I mean, you don’t need to really be anybody special, per se, I mean, we all have these things that we love and enjoy. There’s just ways to get there. And you can be special in your own way of how you do that. But I guess to get into answering your question of like, just my journey. Yeah, I mean, I, it’s so funny, because, you know, I would like to say I’m an entrepreneur, but I just feel like that word is become so loaded nowadays. It’s so overused. I really don’t even like to even use entrepreneur, which I guess is actually interesting. It really, I guess connects back to a big part of who I am, is I always try and just be different. I mean, it just, I mean, I think it’s more important. I think there was a quote, I can’t remember who said this, but they actually said that it’s actually more beneficial for you to be different than it is to be the best. Because even if you are the best, the best is usually temporarily or usually moment, moment, like in moments. There’s always someone who you know you’re competing to because if you’re the best, that means that you’re obviously compared to someone who’s, you know, obviously not as good as you and then that just means you’re going back and forth. battling of always trying to keep up with the Joneses. So I always I always encourage people to just look to be different. Just you really focus on what makes you, you, and really highlight that in your life and, and magnify that, like what what makes you you, you know, that’s the number one gift that you don’t ever have to worry about whether or not you need to learn or go to school for or really compete is just, there’s no one else who is you. So it’s like your best tool. So for me, I mean, I just say I’m a creative, I mean, I don’t even really want to be put in like an entrepreneur’s space, you know, tied to business or, you know, even as a photographer, I know, probably about 70% of my life is copiled of just photography and doing a lot of different creative photoshoots. And working with different brands, and you know, great people, but I really consider myself as a creative because I just love to create, I’m the type of person if I, if I come up with an idea, I want to turn that into reality, I want to turn that into fruition. And that, to me is creation. So I love creating. But I guess maybe in a very short synopsis, if I can, I went to the University of Georgia, I did not graduate I did two years there. I was in network marketing, actually, for about two and a half to three years. And from there, because I was in network marketing, I was actually trying to pay off a lot of expenses, because my parents couldn’t afford anything, you know, taking out a lot of student loans. So instead of working three jobs that I had, while I was at the University of Georgia, I actually went into network marketing, because I got my mind sort of expanded to the idea of sales. And that you know, you don’t have to, you can make as much money as you’d like. Because there’s so many people out there and you’re not capped by the hour, no matter how many, you know, how much you how hard you work, there’s only so many hours in a day. So I got really excited, I was like, man, maybe I can really surpass my income with, you know, this network marketing gig. And that actually ended up happening. At that time, I was the youngest really in my company in my organization. So I was able to really get a lot of great insight and wisdom and mentorship, just because of really just staying focused and putting in hard work and just believing that no matter what your hands are on, I mean, you can really make anything work, especially now today in the world that we live in. So from there, I did really well with that. And because of all the personal development and the growth, I noticed that a lot of people, on average, have maybe challenges with growing and continuing to grow. I mean, if you think about in school, most like most of what we’re doing in school is learning to take a test and be reviewed. And what most people don’t realize is after college or after school, life should still be your test, and you should still continue growing. But because we tie so much of education to a formal institution, once we leave that institution, people stop growing, we think, Oh, we don’t really have any more exams, we don’t have any more tests, you know, so we stop reading the books, we start reading, you know, listening to podcasts, we stop doing all the things that challenge our brain and grow. So I just wrote a book called believing in believing really just it was comprised of a lot of questions that people continued to have, and would talk to me about and I just realized, you know, a lot of people have the same kind of questions, you know, let me just put all this in a book. So I don’t really have to, you know, maybe always have to say the same thing over and over, maybe I could just direct people to like, Dude, I would check out a book of mine and, you know, it really highlights a lot of really where your mindset and your belief system comes from, and how to really rewire that in your favor, to really do the things you want to do in life. So from there, I ended up getting into marketing consulting, because with network marketing, and really, really succeeding at that, I kind of fell into the trap at probably any 19 year old kid would who’s really earning a lot of income at that time, and got into really materialistic things was driving like a 2013 C class Mercedes in 2013 was traveling a ton, wearing Louis Vuitton shoes that I mean, I don’t even know where they are today. I mean, just really silly stuff. I mean, just stuff that’s not I mean, it’s not it’s not invaluable, because it definitely added more knowledge and more wisdom to my belt, but just at the time, obviously, as you get older, you know, anyone who would become wise about where their money goes, you know, these are all material things, you know, these things don’t last. And most people don’t really care about it. And if they do, they’re probably not the right people that you’re really wanting to entertain anyway. So I really needed to get out of that environment. But I still loved personal development and growth. So I would work with friends of mine that were starting startups and companies and because I had to do a lot of marketing myself while I was doing network marketing, I kind of just got creative and like I said, being a creative and just taught friends of mine that led to other companies about marketing consulting, and how to really connect with your audience with the product or the brand that you have. Long story short of how I got into photography, which is where I am now and I’ll kind of ended up there. I don’t want to talk for the whole time. But I that’s kind of what ended up happening because I was doing marketing consulting but when companies would say hey, Myles, we really love this idea. You know, can you go out and photograph? Can you go out and create the video for this? I didn’t have the camera or the skill set. So I would pay friends of mine that were photographers and videographers. But then it just got to the point where I was like, wow, why am I paying out people a skill that I could probably learn myself, I was very naive at that time. So I just decided it’s just pressing buttons, I’m sure I can buy a camera and do this myself. So I went on Craigslist bought a very cheap T5I Canon Rebel camera. And definitely very quickly realized that’s not just pressing buttons. But fortunately, I fell in love with the art of learning photography, and creating photos, and even doing video and just being creative. And then that led to working with a lot of friends, because I would shoot friends very regularly just to practice. And then that led to shooting weddings, because they would get engaged. And then weddings led to just connections of, you know, things that led to other companies and all the other things. So that’s kind of where I am today, there’s probably a little bit more, but that’s kind of how I got to where I got to do probably way too much information. But just to cover all the bases. There we go.
Shaune Teske 10:58
No, I think that’s perfect. And I think, Oh, my goodness, you’ve done so much. And and you said at 19 with some of the stuff, and I forgot, like, yes, you’re still very, very motivated, and very exciting. So that’s why I love that even just in your bio, hey, tell us about yourself, you’re going into life lessons and already motivating people. So that’s why we’re so happy you’re here because there’s so much to share. And I really want to get into kind of what we had asked you to talk about because I think this is such a who you are and such a great thing that you’ve touched on before and even you’ve written this book on, but believing and kind of putting yourself out there. And you had mentioned when we asked you about different things you’d like to talk about, you had brought up this idea of building your business or life through faith and not fear. And I really would like to kind of dig into that right now and go from there of what does that look like? What does it mean to build your business or your life through faith and not fear?
Yeah, you know, I love this. I actually remember writing this in the book, actually. And I think it’s just a very simple story that really can kind of make you go, Oh, that kind of makes sense. You know, you know, my mom, sometimes would say common sense isn’t always so common. But, you know, that’s okay. Because there are a lot of things that really, unfortunately discourage us from thinking in ways that encourage us. But if you think about this, right, so let’s, let’s just talk about belief system. So let’s just say I’m a young boy in school, and there’s this really pretty girl. And because she’s so pretty, I believe. So I believe, because she’s so pretty, that she’s way outside of my league. So here’s what ends up happening. There’s a belief system that is formed that because of whatever reason, I believe if I asked this girl out, she’s gonna say, no. Now, nothing has happened. There’s no like actual facts or grounds for this. But it’s just something I believe because of fear. It just ties into fear. I’m afraid that if I asked her out, she will say no. So here’s the funny thing about living your life through fear, will because I am, I am coming with a perspective of fear first, what ends up happening is you end up creating automatically what you didn’t want in the first place. For example, I’m afraid that if I asked her out, she’s going to say no, that is my belief in fear. Well, then, because I believe that, and that’s my fear, I then do not ask her out. So what automatically happens? She doesn’t go out with me. Right? Because the answer is well, she could say no, right? Yeah, of course. But she could also say what? Yes. So why do we only entertain the no, why do we only entertain the fear? So because I’m afraid to ask her out, then that means she I don’t ask her out. And then that means she obviously will just never, I mean, it just never happens, because I avoided I don’t. So you end up creating what it is that you’re afraid of when you live your life through fear, and then all these other opportunities and all these things start to happen and move when you actually live your life by faith. Doors start opening rather than closing. And it doesn’t always mean every door is going to open. But if you live your life through faith, it means the right doors will. So I guess in terms of building a business, what ended up happening for me is I’m not this like crazy, intellectual business savvy. I didn’t even go to school for business. You know, and obviously today I run my own business. And you know, I obviously work with clients and you know, I’m focusing on profit margins and revenues and creating products and building, just I mean everything that has to do with building a business yet I had no business background beforehand, and I had nothing that could secure my knowledge that this would work other than the fact that I had faith that it would. Now that seems sometimes a little loaded, because people are like, yeah, you have faith that it would be okay, but like, you know, this happened and my friend didn’t, it didn’t work for my friend, or maybe I did something before and it didn’t work for them, or it didn’t work that time, whatever the case may be. Now, that just goes into, again, your belief system. So when you’re going into business, yes, there’s a possibility that your business may fail for a certain amount of time. And that’s something that people don’t realize, it doesn’t mean that it will fail entirely. It’s almost the same thing as if you make a mistake, as a human being. That means you made a mistake, it doesn’t mean you are failure. I mean, when you look at, again, your belief system, it’s how you go about what you’re getting into. And for me, I just knew one thing, there are enough resources, let’s just get practical, there are enough resources to really make anything work. I mean, heck, if I want to just if I, I mean there are people I know who are making a six figure income selling shower curtains. And I literally know this because I really wanted to get into E commerce, e commerce, because I was just really trying to create a different type of income type of income stream. So all these anytime I get into things, I really research it a lot and really dive into it. So I ended up on this podcast of this of this lady who’s making a six figure income. And she’s been interviewed, although I mean, it’s she’s definitely making money. It’s not just I mean, she’s been interviewed, she’s been all over. So I mean, she makes, and you go to our website, I mean, she’s definitely making money. And she sells shower curtains. Now, I’m not going to go into really a whole story behind if anyone wants to know, I mean, obviously, hit me up. But the reality is, she is using the internet to sell shower curtains. Because her idea is anytime you buy a home, which if you think about any human being who’s living on the planet Earth, you need some thing to cover your head. So everyone, if there’s not one product out there that everyone’s always looking for, it’s a place to stay, I mean, you need an apartment, you need a home, I mean, it’s just, that’s just a no brainer. So it’s just like a perfect business. Because then when you move into your home, the very first thing you probably will do more than anything else is make sure there’s a shower curtain, because you can not have pots, maybe go out to eat, I mean, you may not have a bed, maybe you get a you know, you can get a mattress or sleep on the floor. But you definitely want to be able to take a shower, so you’re at least going to put that shower curtain up. So you can at least take some showers. So it’s also a product that like you have to have. So she just got really creative with it. And she dropships it and does really custom shower curtains and makes a six figure income. But of course, she uses an Instagram brand, because she’s built an Instagram page for it. She’s done some ad stuff, you know, she’s actually studied, you know, just the type of fabric that’s best for this and this and wrote blogs on, you know, on shower curtains, and then the people who make the shower. I mean, there’s just so many tools out there. So why do we believe that if we get into a new business, that it won’t work out for us? It all just goes back into what you’re choosing to believe. So I can maybe answer any other question diving more into that specifically. But I think just touching on in general about belief systems and business. The key is to believe that it can work for you, not just for someone else. And the way that that will really happen for you is number one, just understand that there are enough resources out there for you to make anything happen. You can learn it. I mean, you don’t need to have, you know, an $80,000 value degree, when there’s YouTube and Google, there’s so many things that are out there that will open your minds podcasts like this, that will really give you insight on how to do things. I mean, of course, if it’s like certainly, you know, if you’re going to be a surgeon, don’t just Google that. But obviously, it makes sense on most businesses that are creative businesses or entrepreneurial business and things that, you know, you can very much find information out there very easily now. I mean, the internet is so big knowledge is so accessible, there’s just no more excuses. So that would be number one. And then number two would be what is your belief about the challenges that you will go through? So it’s not about oh, I don’t want to get to this business because it might get hard or I might it might not work. I would go into it believing and knowing that it is going to get hard. And yeah, it actually may not work. But you won’t stop, right? There is a quote out there as you only fail when you quit. I mean, if you just maneuver if you really adapt, I mean just like anything in the world that needs to adapt or maneuver or overcome whatever obstacle, we have that ability to do that as well. So just thinking about the challenges as well that these aren’y roadblocks or a wall that I can’t get over. These are merely just learning opportunities that will propel me into the direction more of where I want to go and become more wise.
Wow, that was a lot of amazing information.
Sarah Schrader 19:52
As you were talking, I was thinking of questions and then you just start answering them as you’re going along.
Shaune Teske 20:01
I did have a question off of that. We’re talking about it, I feel like we’re starting to dig into it a little bit. What are some practical tips for people who are trying to live in faith over fear? You mentioned? Yeah, we have a lot of information out there, we can start looking. But how do you start with that mindset that your faith can be bigger?
Yes. So I’m a firm believer, Martin Luther King says this, you don’t need to see the entire staircase to get to the top, you only need to see what? The first step. I think a lot of people, I wrote this in my book, have this elephant syndrome, where they look at the entire elephant it’s so large, rather than looking at how can they break this down into tiny pieces that is consumable for them. So practical things for that is just start with what you have A and then B start with where you are, right? That’s really the reality. So my whole thing is, is if it’s a belief system that you have about, okay, when I do something, you know, I like, I don’t know, I get discouraged, or, or hesitate to really get started, or I usually sort of fall back. That is just because of habit. Everything we do in life is a habit. So if you see an opportunity, and you take it, yes, it may not work. But if if you at least take the opportunity, you will build a habit of trusting yourself and having faith that the things that you want to do, you can make work for you. So what I’m saying is you have to start building the habit of taking opportunities, you have to start building the habit of strengthening your faith, rather than strengthening the fear. So start with what you have, let’s just say your own health. There are a lot of people out here today that could be taking could, first of all, could change their health. But then number two, can really build so many incredible habits by actually tackling and trying to change their health, their fitness. I mean, there’s so many people I know in my life, especially in the entrepreneur world that just very simply don’t have a very regular fitness regimen don’t have a regular fitness schedule, or don’t have any fitness goals, or don’t, they’re not really actively doing anything fitness wise. Now, do you need $80,000 to start a fitness journey? Do you need a seven year degree to start a fitness journey? Do you need you know, six years of mentorship and and courses and personal development to start a fitness journey? No. Right? So start with where you are with what you have. You have your own body and where you are right now, if you’re not really that confident, being able to do something like a business or get into a business, can you not start to Okay, let’s get into a habit of going to the gym three times a week, every Monday, Wednesday and Friday, I will be at the gym, when you start building the habit of committing to something like that. And then actually seeing results that will actually channel something in your brain that will start to tell you Okay, things that I want to do. I can A, figure out the steps again, going back to the resources there enough resource, I can figure out the steps to do that. And then B, I can commit to this and know that any challenges I have I can overcome them and whatnot. So I mean, it can be very simple as going Google type in you know, if you’re a lady if you’re female, there’s there’s so many girls out there that are literally building brands on how to help women in their fitness. Right? I mean, even on Instagram, there’s these just mega fitness models that are doing videos, like their whole Instagram is just videos of all these different workouts. I’ve actually taken several workouts that I do at the gym from some of these women. And there’s nothing, I’m not saying any anything sexist about it, I’m just trying to share with people like I mean, you can even go very specific. Some women, they’re like, oh, you know, the gyms like for guys, I don’t want to get buff. And I mean, no, no, there’s no, there’s so much out there that will literally give you the knowledge that you need to do what it is that you want to do. So go and google go and Instagram, start looking at different fitness, you know, routines, start with a simple schedule, I’m going to go two times a week, three times a week, commit to that set of goal. I mean, these are things that are going to start to give you what you need in order to do the things that you want to do in the future in terms of a business or other things because it will start to build your confidence. And when things get hard. That doesn’t mean don’t do it. It just means get creative, adapt and go through it. So I hope that makes sense.
Sarah Schrader 24:19
That makes perfect sense. Actually, Shaune and I just recorded an episode recently for our book club and one of the quotes that we pulled out there was to like run into your fears.
Myles Berrio 24:29
yeah, I would I agree with that. But I also know that everybody is different. So for me, I was, just because of, I mean that I can we can go into the neuro psychology of like, maybe why but I don’t we don’t have to spend all that all the time. You know, figuring out up into that point, why my mind was in a way that allowed me to do this, but I know for me, I actually I actually get motivated by fear. When I’m afraid to do something. I really actually want to do it more. I look at it as okay, this is not healthy. Why am I afraid to do this? So I’ll challenge myself to just go do it. And sometimes it’ll mean not burning bridges with relationships, but burning bridges with excuses. Like, I’ll go all in, you know, there’s some people out there that will say, you know, you should keep a job, you should keep a nine to five job while you’re building your business part time. Now, I totally would agree with the benefits of doing that. But I don’t agree in terms of if you know who you are, if that’ll work for you. Because for me, I actually didn’t keep a nine to five job or have a job. I like was driven by being broke. I mean, just the idea of being broke, like put so much fear in me. I didn’t give myself excuses. You know, because for some people who maybe need to go that route, when they have a nine to five, because their security, they actually don’t push themselves the way they should. You know, I can’t remember, he’s one of the Shark Tank hosts, and he was the founder of FUBU. Oh, gosh, I’m forgetting his name. Daymond Johnson, Daymond, John or Damien. He wrote a book called The Power of Broke. I mean, he’s a billion. I mean, these are real things. This isn’t just Oh, Myles, which is being kind of, you know, motivate No, no, there are people who are billionaires who came from nothing, and broke and busted, and disgusted neighborhoods that had no money given to them and no knowledge of business. And they’re billionaires today. And they write a book called The Power of Being Broke, not the power of, you know, keeping necessarily a job, you know, taking a building out of a six year plan, going step by step, you know what I mean? So now that’s okay, if you do that, again, if that’s how you roll, you need to know who you are, if you’re a planner, if you’re someone who will execute, when you do have the steps than do that, don’t give your self excuses not to, but if you’re someone who if, by looking for all the steps, it impairs you to move forward, it hinders you from taking action, then you maybe need to check and see whether or not you’re someone who’s motive motivated when your butt’s sitting on a candle of fire, when you have no money in your bank account. And you’re like I need I need to make this like now I need to make this happen now, and you get creative, and you get creative, and you bust out of there. So that goes into another topic of knowing who you are as well, that I think really helps with your belief system. Because everything that we believe comes from other people, when we were born into this world, we knew nothing, we accepted where we were. And that’s just the reality. Now you can find truths in your journey. But the idea is everything you believe today came from somewhere, right? We were literally flesh, we were literally just human being we were babies crying, we had no concept of things, everything you believe about love, business, fear, all these things you learn. So what does that mean? If there are things that you know, today, that are impairing your ability to move in the direction of where you want to go in life, then you can let go of those beliefs and start accepting new beliefs. And that all happens by stripping who the world told you to be, and start really diving into who you are, and actually understanding who you are as a faithful believer, I say who you are in Christ. So that, I don’t know if that hopefully that answered your question. But, that goes probably into another direction, but yeah.
Shaune Teske 28:06
No, that’s perfect. I wanted to see if there was a way that our listeners could get to that point, like, how do you figure out what type of person are you that you’re driven by being broke? Or I need to have this safety net? because of whatever reason? How, what are the practices that you think they can take that help them figure out what type of person they are? What type of mindset they have about fear?